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azuriteI don't think I've ever been the type to take constructive criticism very well, even if I preach that people should-- and that it *is* just that-- constructive. So far, one more review has lead me to the belief that I need a beta. ;_; It'd be nice if Ma'atkare would volunteer or something, since I a) greatly admire her fanfiction, "Full Circle," for its fluidity and excellent in-character-ness; and b) appreciate her pointing out my own faults... sometimes the praise goes to my head, yanno?
I make sentences long with my --dashes-- and ;semi colons; so... what can I do about that? My chapters are insanely long; I really need someone to help me with that. I'm kinda scared to actually go to a community about constructive criticism (like![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-community.gif)
con_crit), but I know I should. I don't want to end up labeled a Badfic, or a Goodfic Gone Wrong, or something. ;_; I'm trying so hard with WDKY...
Hey, so I got Anzu for the YGO RPG! But what name should I pick? The RPG is Japanese-name based, so teagardner is out... but what about...
* magician_faith
* faith_magic
* faith_magician
* dancedance_anzu
* blue_eyes_anzu
* blueeyes_anzu
* blueeyed_angel
Or something else???? HELP!
Okay, back to the topic at hand! ConCrit! So Ma'atkare pointed out something that I'm a huge protestor of-- OOC. My Kaiba *is* OOC, isn't he? I mean, can you really call a character OOC when you put them in a situation unlike anything in the fandom? I had to warp around certain facts and events that would have invariably changed the fandom --and thusly, my fanfiction-- but isn't that the whole point of "what if?" Not to be OOC, of course, but to present plausible reasons why a character would act the way they do in a fanfiction?
And, 9 parts into the fic, has Tea completely forgotten about her family? I don't think so-- in this upcoming part, especially, the focus is on her family, trust, and... the breakdown of the things you hold dear. I have a lot of messages and morals sprinkled throughout WDKY; this is one of them.
Ma'atkare also brought up the subject of Yugi and Co's involvement. Yeah, this is a Seto/Tea fic, so how can I plausibly bring in Yugi and the others without making it your run-of-the-mill triangle fic? In those, sorry to say, Seto, Joey, and Yugi *always* act the same. Maybe I'm dodging the inevitable (that is, bad writing) by not using them at all. *frowns* I try to consider pivotal points of the story when certain characters have to appear, and I've just had no use for the guys in those early chapters. They would *try* and be there, but fail. From Tea's standpoint, I can understand-- I've lost people very close to me, and sometimes you're not receptive to your friends, no matter what.
Support from the guys will majorly factor in in WDKY10, but... I have to get 9 out first, you know?
Someone else pointed out how I say that WDKY is not yaoi or yuri, etc, and why do I keep pointing it out? Uhm, have you LOOKED at the FFnet YGO archive lately? Why do you think so many authors have jumped on the yaoi/yuri filter bandwagon? Aside from fandoms where slash/yaoi or yuri are canon, anime fandoms with a male overdose tend to have too much yaoi than is healthy, necessary, and... otherwise "okay." It's one thing if every author that writes it does their best and makes it sound somewhat plausible (as with any other pairing or event circumstances), but yeesh, the amount of idiotic Ryou/Bakura fics, or Yami/Yugi, or HELL, Joey/Seto!! It's like, OMGWTF are these people THINKING????
^^; Maybe DSF just doesn't frequent the archives as much. :P Why would she, when she gets excellent fic chapters from Mamono before the rest of us? *pouts*
Okay, I joined con_crit. *sucks in a breath* I can do this. I need this. I am not some overinflated, selfindulgent twit.
Help?
I make sentences long with my --dashes-- and ;semi colons; so... what can I do about that? My chapters are insanely long; I really need someone to help me with that. I'm kinda scared to actually go to a community about constructive criticism (like
con_crit), but I know I should. I don't want to end up labeled a Badfic, or a Goodfic Gone Wrong, or something. ;_; I'm trying so hard with WDKY...Hey, so I got Anzu for the YGO RPG! But what name should I pick? The RPG is Japanese-name based, so teagardner is out... but what about...
* magician_faith
* faith_magic
* faith_magician
* dancedance_anzu
* blue_eyes_anzu
* blueeyes_anzu
* blueeyed_angel
Or something else???? HELP!
Okay, back to the topic at hand! ConCrit! So Ma'atkare pointed out something that I'm a huge protestor of-- OOC. My Kaiba *is* OOC, isn't he? I mean, can you really call a character OOC when you put them in a situation unlike anything in the fandom? I had to warp around certain facts and events that would have invariably changed the fandom --and thusly, my fanfiction-- but isn't that the whole point of "what if?" Not to be OOC, of course, but to present plausible reasons why a character would act the way they do in a fanfiction?
And, 9 parts into the fic, has Tea completely forgotten about her family? I don't think so-- in this upcoming part, especially, the focus is on her family, trust, and... the breakdown of the things you hold dear. I have a lot of messages and morals sprinkled throughout WDKY; this is one of them.
Ma'atkare also brought up the subject of Yugi and Co's involvement. Yeah, this is a Seto/Tea fic, so how can I plausibly bring in Yugi and the others without making it your run-of-the-mill triangle fic? In those, sorry to say, Seto, Joey, and Yugi *always* act the same. Maybe I'm dodging the inevitable (that is, bad writing) by not using them at all. *frowns* I try to consider pivotal points of the story when certain characters have to appear, and I've just had no use for the guys in those early chapters. They would *try* and be there, but fail. From Tea's standpoint, I can understand-- I've lost people very close to me, and sometimes you're not receptive to your friends, no matter what.
Support from the guys will majorly factor in in WDKY10, but... I have to get 9 out first, you know?
Someone else pointed out how I say that WDKY is not yaoi or yuri, etc, and why do I keep pointing it out? Uhm, have you LOOKED at the FFnet YGO archive lately? Why do you think so many authors have jumped on the yaoi/yuri filter bandwagon? Aside from fandoms where slash/yaoi or yuri are canon, anime fandoms with a male overdose tend to have too much yaoi than is healthy, necessary, and... otherwise "okay." It's one thing if every author that writes it does their best and makes it sound somewhat plausible (as with any other pairing or event circumstances), but yeesh, the amount of idiotic Ryou/Bakura fics, or Yami/Yugi, or HELL, Joey/Seto!! It's like, OMGWTF are these people THINKING????
^^; Maybe DSF just doesn't frequent the archives as much. :P Why would she, when she gets excellent fic chapters from Mamono before the rest of us? *pouts*
Okay, I joined con_crit. *sucks in a breath* I can do this. I need this. I am not some overinflated, selfindulgent twit.
Help?
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Mamono the Support Angel! (O.O!! Needles! *runs off*)
Date: 2004-03-22 09:07 am (UTC)Feel better?
^^; I'm probably just as bad at taking constructive criticism as you... I just hide it well... *grins shamefully* I really don't think you have anything to worry about it. Kaiba in WDKY, I think, is very IC. You know, I think some people take his cold behavior too far. He's not some dog who's going to bite you if you talk to him, or at least that's what I think. I mean, if you look at past episodes he's supported Yugi numerous times(So who cares if it's in odd situations... He still did it.), he's helped him out a couple times(at the end of battle city...well, you'd know if you've read ahead of the US anime...) and I they've worked together and all. I don't know, I just think some author's take his personality to the extreme... *dreamy sigh* He's seems like a chivalist knight that left his castle... ^^;
Anyway... I thought WDKY was a little unoriginal, well, at first, that is. You took that plot and totally made it your own! I think you're doing a really good job with it... and ignore the update remarks(even from me) Writing chapters that long and that detailed takes time and well, it's not the only thing going on in your life, right? You know, no matter how long it takes for an update, your reviewers will review no matter what...(Especially since Seto is Dun dun dun arrested!! O.o ) So basically what I'm saying is: Don't lose confidence in WDKY, it's a great story and if it ever was put in the horredous categoryn of "Bad Fic" then ISE wouldn't be fit to live under a rock...
Okay so all that coming from a person who started writing less than a year ago probably seems pretty foolish(and littered with horrible grammmar...) eh, you can take it or leave it, but keep up WKDY!!
You're right. DSF doesn't go out and read through a lot of fics, but she's really strong on the whole Yaoi/Yuri thing. Her openmindedness is really cool... ^^; Yes, and she's a pretty good beta for ISE.... My other "stories" are littered with bad grammar and I know it... I have to revise those soon... Eh, well, in other events, ISE should be updated somtime in the next week or so(I hope) because I'm on spring break...
^___^ You got Tea? Alright! Ha, I like the name faith_magician! It's awesome!
Re: Mamono the Support Angel! (O.O!! Needles! *runs off*)
Date: 2004-03-22 11:23 pm (UTC)The thing that irritates me about Kaiba and OC-ness is the fact that Kaiba is SO different in the manga than in the anime. And in the anime, he plays a tremendous role, while by the ass-end of the manga, he's... well, kinda secondary. Which is ubersad.
So I started writing while working today, and I came up with this:
"A character has CHARACTERistics or traits. To be Out-of-Character (OOC) is to be lacking one or more of those traits, or likewise, to have one or more traits not usually found in said character present."
I compiled a list of traits I thought the primary players of WDKY had, and of course, this is just a matter of opinion:
Tea: friendly, loyal, stubborn, pushy, kind/helpful, determined, smart, lucky
Seto: callous, cold, intelligent, strategist, loner, loyal, tactless, stubborn, self-sacrificing
Yugi: naive, kind, loyal, scared/nervous
Joey: brash, stubborn, street-smart (as opposed to book-smart), loyal
...that's a tad bit subjective, but I think such a list (and if you want to add or comment on it, please do!) would be helpful to authors to avoid "OOC." Generalizing a character to their barest forms (when readers couldn't disagree over what traits made a character OOC or not) might be the best way of going about it-- and like wickeddawn said, archetyping them. I wonder what some common character archetypes are...?
WDKY will go on- Part 9 has been bothering me waaaay too much for me to let it go now!
Re: Mamono the Support Angel! (O.O!! Needles! *runs off*)
Date: 2004-03-24 05:01 pm (UTC)Hm... I guess I'll just have to take your word for it on the Manga Seto, seeing as I've only read about the "evil" him...
Yes, that list looks pretty nice! Though I'd add "brave" to Yugi and Tea's... Okay so all of the characters are pretty brave, but I think those two show it the most, you know?
^^ WDKY 9! Heh, you said there's going to be 36(or was it 38?) chapters? I'm in a state of shock and awe with that! ^___^ That's so awesome!! Good luck!
no subject
Date: 2004-03-22 12:14 pm (UTC)I agree also with the whole thing you said in your rebuttal (<-- spelled correctly?) about Seto being OOC. Well, considering the fact that your fic is AU in some aspects while not in others (much like my own Riddles) is going to almost guarantee the differences that will occur in the character. Because Seto is not in the present YGO universe, he is not confined to the in-characterness that so many people have expected of him. And damn it all if it isn't *YOUR* fiction and you can do whatever the hell you want with it...
*Goes off venting and blowing steam out through her nose like a medieval dragon*
:O
Date: 2004-03-22 11:39 pm (UTC)(1) I gratefully accept any concrit anyone wants to send to me, especially another author that I respect and admire! So... short of being painfully brutal, have at it!
(2) The thing about OOC... I replied to Mamono, and I was talking about character traits and such-- can you think of any archetypes, stereotypes, or heck, general traits that the YGO cast have? It's subjective to a degree, I realize, but... well, any input is appreciated.
;) Thanks.
Nani?!
Date: 2004-03-22 10:07 pm (UTC)This is Ma'atkare here (in case you didn't recognize the LJ name.) I'm glad I followed your LJ link in your profile.
No, no, no! I did not want to discourage you, Az! *huggles you* I think you're doing an excellent job with WDKY. It was one of the first Seto/Anzu fics I read when I got into writing YGO stories.
Constructive criticism was supposed to help you, not make you feel bad. ;_;. Now I feel horrible. Maybe I'm just too bluntly honest, and if so, I apologize.
You should never, ever, EVER feel down because of CC. It's vital to your writing. The trick is to keep chugging along. One day, once you've finished WDKY, you can go back and do a bit of editing if you so wish...it's all apart of evolving as a writer.
Arggh... Honestly, I didn't know that this was going hit home like that, I'm sorry. :/
The only reason why I mentioned those two points was because they would make the story a little more realistic. The writing style, I think, is great in the fact that it makes the story very up close and personal---you feel like you're there. If you could only tweak Seto's character a bit, make him a little more sarcastic, I'm certain things would fall into place.
As for Yugi and the gang, don't worry about it for now... They're not part of the story (at least I don't think they are) in the chapters to follow. Concentrate on making your improvements in parts to come. Worry about everything else later. You've got lots of fans eager to see more of the story... including myself :)
And don't let me EVER see you lack faith in yourself as a writer, you hear me? *shakes fist.* I don't know you very well, but I can still box your ears if I have to ;)
Arrgh... Don't ever scare me like that ^_^
As for grammar and such, yes... that's something a beta reader could fix... or you could fix yourself by printing out a copy of the story and going over the page with a red marker. Believe me, you catch things better that way than scrolling down a screen.
If you'd still like a Beta Reader anyway, I'd be happy to volunteer. :)
*hugz ya and winks*
Take care, dear. Feel free to throw a brick at my motor mouth next time ^_^
*holds up anti-yaoi sign* Kudos!
Re: Nani?!
Date: 2004-03-22 11:43 pm (UTC)In any case, no amount of flames or concrit will stop me from writing-- ever. I'm always on the lookout to improve, and it's great knowing people have the guts/smarts to tell me when I f*ck up, even in the littlest way. OOC is one of my big issues, so when *I* do it, I want to remedy it. It's not a matter of "do it, fast" but "get it done right." That's why I take so long in updating, as I don't post until every scene is done to my satisfaction-- at the time. I've been known to edit a post mere minutes after it goes live, because I've caught some spelling error. ^^;
I'd love a beta; I just have no idea how to go about... er, doing anything. o_O As egocentric as this sounds, I've never had one, and never thought I'd need one. :P
The only brick I'll be throwing is a chocolate one. Kudos to you!